Troy (Spoilers for EP 3 Trailer)

I'm guessing everyone hates him at this point...

I'm guessing I might be the only one that doesn't hate Troy's guts, wants to send him to hell, kill him, rip his throat out, and all that... Now before I begin I would just like you to know that, I try to defend most characters, even though they may seem or are bad. I try to see the good side, and reasons to why they did what they did. Usually I am fighting for Lilly, Larry, Ben, and any other characters getting hated on. (Special thanks to MerakMissile2 for defending Vernon and his group, and anyone else who tries to think like me and him.)

In real life, there is child labor, trafficking, abuse(mentally, physically, and sexually), child soldiers, poor, hungry, thirsty, dying, and many more. If you can't handle a hit to the face then your as sheltered as Sarah. It's a cruel world, but you need to accept the fact that stuff like this happens every day, and you can't go and kill every person who has committed these foul deeds. "Killing is bad no matter what." --Lee.

"I do it because it's necessary. That doesn't make it good." -Lee. He says this afterwards. For me it depends on what happens next episode. If I absolutely have to, with reason, and meaning behind it then I will kill him. But if we have the choice I may most likely spare him.

I am quite against killing. Your ending a persons life. I just find that terrifying. I don't believe anyone should die except maybe those psycho, demon possessed, crazy ass people who can't even control themselves, and don't know right only wrong. Believe me. In real life I hate a lot of people, especially the trolls. But killing goes a little too far for me. Maybe a beating, jail time, or some kind of small punishment(good enough so that they understand) will teach them that what they did was bad.

Don't judge a book by its cover. "BUT HE HIT CLEM!" Yeah... So? You haven't even seen or played the episode yet. I always like to see the facts first before judging a 5 second clip. I agree that he deserves some punishment but I'm not killing him. Carver is the real bad guy/antagonist here, and I'm pretty sure TellTale made that clear.

After we play Episode 3, that's a different story. We know what's going on, why he did it, and his motives. Could he be as crazy as Carver? Is he following orders? What if he tries to help you escape? What is hes an undercover spy trying to bring down Carver? Could Clem have pissed him off in some way?

We don't know anything except that he hit Clem. And for me, that's pretty bad. But killing him for me is not the answer. I would like to see more on Troy, and his personality. If we have the choice to kill him, I won't.

How many people killed both of the St John brothers? Last time I checked only around 22% of players. So your saying you would kill a guy who hit Clem, but you spare cannibals who could have eaten her, or worse?

So I am ready for down votes. Go ahead and click that button. I can see it already. Call me a troll, or an idiot. I don't really care. This is my opinion and you can't prove me otherwise. After episode 3 is released, then you can prove me wrong. I will most likely(around 90%) be wrong, but I hate to see people getting so much hate. All the hate comments have made me generate this thread. Haters gotta hate, and I know that. Hopefully I can convince you all otherwise. I know I can't as I have tried before, but its worth a shot.

Can't wait for the next episode! Love you guys and hope I haven't offended anyone.
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Comments

  • edited May 2014
    Don't worry about the downvotes because you have a point. I'm gonna admit that this text didn't change what I think of Troy. But yeah I understand your perspective.
  • Up votes?!..... I'm dreaming aren't I?

    This is kind of a bump because Troy and Tavia DO NOT deserve death threats. (Well not yet if they are truly evil at heart.)
  • Fucking invalids
  • WhatTheDuckWhatTheDuck Banned
    edited May 2014
    Why is Tavia getting death threats it makes no sense?
  • I KNOW. Troy I can understand. But Tavia... Okay.... That kind of crossed the line. Next thing you know and people will say Reggie is evil...
    WhatTheDuck posted: »

    Why is Tavia getting death threats it makes no sense?

  • edited May 2014
    You know why people spared the St. Johns? It was because 8 year old Clem was watching it. They were spared because people care for Clem. Now that she is 11 and has seen it all it makes sense. Troy hit her so that made the people that care for Clem want Troy dead.
    Update: I am not arguing with you, I am just trying to explain the St. John part to you
  • WTF? There were 13 likes, and when I liked this thread it showed 15 likes! Well, here's a double upvote!
  • I find it funny how before the trailer a lot of people found Troy interesting, and now everyone wants to murder him. I'm a fan too and I care about Clem, but going bananas just because he hurt one of my favorite characters is too much.
  • Good point. But for Danny (And I'm pretty sure many killed him) people didn't know she was there and killed him. It's too bad the statistics didn't show the percentages of who spared and killed Danny, and Andy.

    But yeah. I can understand where the people who don't like Troy are coming from. Thanks for commenting!

    You know why people spared the St. Johns? It was because 8 year old Clem was watching it. They were spared because people care for

  • Well, just because worse things happen doesn't mean we have to just say "Well, since worse things happen we'll just ignore this." He slammed the butt of his rifle into a child's face, which takes quite a bit to justify. I'd say that people have a right to hate him at this point, and should be able to say as much until more information comes up that vindicates him, so to speak. I don't hate him, personally, because I've always been a Troy fan (yes, even though he never says anything. ESPECIALLY because he never says anything). I'm willing to wait to render my judgement until we have the whole story, but it'd take a hell of a lot for Troy to come across as a cool guy after that scene no matter what.
  • Thanks! Why do you have 3 down votes? :(
    hihitwd posted: »

    WTF? There were 13 likes, and when I liked this thread it showed 15 likes! Well, here's a double upvote!

  • Why do you have 3 downvotes too?

    Thanks! Why do you have 3 down votes? :(

  • No problem :D You're one of my favorite users XD

    Good point. But for Danny (And I'm pretty sure many killed him) people didn't know she was there and killed him. It's too bad the

  • Either down vote trolls. Or people who disagree with me and want to kill Troy badly.
    goodcop2 posted: »

    Why do you have 3 downvotes too?

  • edited May 2014
    I can't stress how much I agree.

    Some of the people on this forum scare me sometimes with how easily they say they'll murder.

    Some poster even said he wanted Tavia to die gruesomely!
  • Am I the only one that killed every bad fucker in this game? Not killing the St. johns is just cruel, they would have died no matter what. I didn't kill Danny because I hated him I killed him because I would rather die a quick death rather than being eaten alive. When the living dead are walking the earth killing is necessary. Do you really think that Larry would have wanted to come back as zombie? Do you really think Mark wouldn't rather have had a bullet in his head than 2 legs used as dinner. I do agree that we need to give Troy some more time but he seens to need a beating, he acts like a muppet that does everything Carver wants him to do. It's people like that we really need kill. And your lee quote is optinal to say so It really just looks stupid using that as an argument.
  • This forum has become psychopathic. They want to torture fictional characters to death becoming just as bad as them.
  • OMG YES! Thank you. *Insert Clem "Thank You" gif*

    You and almost everyone who commented here just made my day.

    No problem :D You're one of my favorite users XD

  • MusicBoxMusicBox Banned
    edited May 2014
    The only reason I spared the brothers were that so they would get eaten, not because I didn't want to kill them. Also it saved me from doing it in front of Clem, which was something I definitely didn't want.
    I understand why people would want to kill Troy, the guy smashed Clementine's face with the butt of his rifle. Not a lot can justify that. Especially not saying "oh well, this is how the world works now, just accept and move on.", if as you quoted "killing is bad no matter what" then hurting someone for trying to escape (which I guess what Clem will try to do) is not good either. Even if he's just following orders, it's still bad. (Also in the trailer you can see him pushing Clem around so I'm guessing the rifle to the head isn't just a one time thing, this guy doesn't care.)
    Right now I'm hating him but I don't want to condemn him to death without seeing the episode, still it would take a miracle for me to like him after what I've seen.
  • edited May 2014
    I agree. If a zombie apocalypse hits. I guess I'm going to be like Christa. Can't really trust anyone, except the select few of people like you, Cluke_is_Dumb, Flog61 and anyone else who doesn't want to kill Troy :D.
    Lee4ever posted: »

    This forum has become psychopathic. They want to torture fictional characters to death becoming just as bad as them.

  • I agree with you. Yeah, we saw what we saw. But we don't even know thing about him yet. Maybe he was forced to do it, like Bonnie was forced to invade the ski lodge. I don't think people should be hating on him YET. We'll just have to wait for Episode 3...
  • Yeah. But after Lee says that Clem says "But you do it to protect me" And Lee responds "I do it because its necessary."

    I think killing isn't as bad if it has meaning and reason behind it. As long as its absolutely necessary, makes sense, and has a lot of reason, then I would do it.
    MusicBox posted: »

    The only reason I spared the brothers were that so they would get eaten, not because I didn't want to kill them. Also it saved me

  • Everyone's different. I respect that you made the decisions you did.

    So who cares if its optional? It's still a quote, so at least its legitimately coming from the writers of the game, and one of the characters backing me up optionally.

    Am I the only one that killed every bad fucker in this game? Not killing the St. johns is just cruel, they would have died no matt

  • MusicBoxMusicBox Banned
    edited May 2014
    That's exactly what I think too, I was just replying to that quote because the rest wasn't there. If you go by that quote alone, there are so many harmful people in that world sooner or later one would have to kill.
    As I said I don't want to condemn Troy to death or talk big before I know more about the episode but I don't really think Clem could do such a horrible thing that smashing her head with a rifle would become necessary. Then again I've been trolled by Telltale many times, who knows? :)

    Also want to clarify I wasn't trying to argue or anything if my original post came across like it, if it did I apologize.

    Yeah. But after Lee says that Clem says "But you do it to protect me" And Lee responds "I do it because its necessary." I thi

  • Ah sorry :D. I'll fix that I guess. I understand your points and its cool with me.

    And no problem. It didn't sound like you were arguing to me. You were just saying what you thought was right.

    Thanks for your response! It's good to see what people think about Troy after seeing the trailer
    MusicBox posted: »

    That's exactly what I think too, I was just replying to that quote because the rest wasn't there. If you go by that quote alone, t

  • because she duped us bro
  • I believe you meant to reply to the wanting Tavia dead?

    Hey when you played 400 days some of the dialogue for her kind of warned you that you don't have to trust her. Here are some quotes (I don't think I got them all perfect but their similar)

    Vince: "How can we trust you?"

    Tavia: "You don't"


    Tavia: "I'm not trying to force you. We just need people and that's it. You can stay or you can come with me."

    Walkie Talkie Guy: "Don't force them. We only want people who want to be here"

    Tavia: "It's your choice"
    casdow90 posted: »

    because she duped us bro

  • It's always refreshing when someone plays devil's advocate, even more so when they present such an eloquent and thought provoking argument. Thinking about this really hit me hard on a personal level, which is a first on this site.

    At first, I was kind of taken aback by how much irrational hatred I felt toward Troy after watching that scene in the trailer. I'm almost always inclined to give the bad guy the benefit of the doubt and go into situations with an open mind. But when I saw Troy smash Clem in the face with his rifle-butt, I desperately wanted Telltale to give her the option of summoning Zombie Lee to tear him limb from limb. At first, I chalked it up to a sort of paternal rage, but that doesn't really make sense, since I wasn't that upset when Carver punched Clementine and held her a gunpoint. Only after thinking on it for a while, did I realize why I was so pissed.

    I don't hate Troy. I hate what he represents..

    For many people, Clementine is a symbol of humanity's good virtues. She represents hope, compassion and innocence in a universe that is sorely lacking in those regards. Perhaps more importantly, Troy's willingness to beat down a little girl shows a savage contempt for human life that is all too common, both in TWD universe and real life. His actions represent the thing about this world that I despise the most.

    Now I realize how hypocritical that is. I believe that Troy and people like him deserves to die because they represent contempt for life. Ouch, talk about throwing your worldview for a loop. I don't know if you're argument won Troy a reprieve, but I'm definitely a lot more conflicted about killing him now.
  • I honestly wouldn't do such bad things if I were to actually be in the ZA. Well, i'd only be bad to those who wrong me or my friends, that's when i'll go ape shit on them.
    Lee4ever posted: »

    This forum has become psychopathic. They want to torture fictional characters to death becoming just as bad as them.

  • I remember a time when everyone wanted Larry dead, yet when given the opportunity to help Kenny kill him, most opted to try and save him.
  • I'm going to take that as a compliment. :D

    What you say makes sense. Thanks for your in depth point. Its awesome to see all the different viewpoints of fans!
    BigBlindMax posted: »

    It's always refreshing when someone plays devil's advocate, even more so when they present such an eloquent and thought provoking

  • Most would argue because Clem was there.

    But yeah. I believe around 60% tried to save Larry. I guess maybe later we got to know him more.

    I remember a time when everyone wanted Larry dead, yet when given the opportunity to help Kenny kill him, most opted to try and save him.

  • Imagine.... The person who hit her wasn't actually Troy.

    Remember the preview for S2 E2? The person who was at the door was Troy. But in the game it was actually Carver... I doubt it would happen but it would definitely be a major troll lol.
  • The forum is a scary place...
  • edited May 2014
    No kidding.

    Especially forum user Dont_Look_Back

    Check her recent posts, avatar, and thread.

    I'll give her most dedicated hater of Troy award
    iHeartTWD posted: »

    The forum is a scary place...

  • edited May 2014
    Currently I dislike Troy for obvious reasons, but my opinion could change once the episode is out. Honestly, all I can see him as is an average militia grunt who does whatever he's told, and may be sadistic and/or apathetic to the suffering of others. I don't really think he's worth killing. But I can't say for sure yet.

    As for the people who are immediately jumping the gun, wanting to kill Troy... I'm sure if we ever got the chance to kill or torture him, a good percentage of players wouldn't do it. People tend to talk big up until they actually have the chance. (Larry, Danny St. John, Tweedle Dum in TWAU) I can see why people hate Troy, (and rightfully so, hitting Clem *is* child abuse) and wanting retribution is completely understandable, but wanting to downright torture him is a bit fanatical. I hate discussing morality since it's such a sensitive subject, but that's just the way I see it.
  • I actually agree with you, mostly. The first time I played TWD I made all the "morally sound" choices because that's what I usually do in games. I don't know if it's because that's who I am or whaft I've been taught, but the second time I chose the more pragmatic choices. In a real life situation I believe I'd do a combination of both. The idealistic realist.

    As for Troy, once my initial anger has subsided, I'm starting to try and rationalize his action. Whatever his reasoning though, I doubt it will redeem him in eyes. Same goes for Carver, after he killed a certain someone at the lodge.
  • dojo32161dojo32161 Moderator
    Then it's kind of ironic if they take Russell, he only wants his grandmother, he doesn't want to be there (at least initially).

    I believe you meant to reply to the wanting Tavia dead? Hey when you played 400 days some of the dialogue for her kind of war

  • edited May 2014
    Despite having stated a way to kill him on one of the "death to Troy" threads, I could never bring myself to kill him. I use to think if I was completely justified I could kill someone who was doing an incredibly bad thing. Then one night I had a very vivid nightmare. In it there was this man. He took hostage a bunch of young children and had them in a bomb-filled room to which he was holding the detonator. He didn't see me and i had a chance to take him out and save all the kids. I received lots of praise and everyone thought I was a hero. I felt like a monster. The deathblow was soul-scarring and the whole world felt like a darker place. Any justification I had only pushed the guilt down, never got rid of it. The only thing i began to want was to take it back, everything else seemed so petty. I've never been happier waking up, it felt like a second chance. I'll never forget it.
  • This guy slammed a little girl in the face with the butt of a gun. She's bruised and bleeding, she's knocked to the ground. There's NOTHING in my mind that can excuse that. He can fucking rot, and I don't care if it's "irrational" of me to think that. He's a fictional character. He's not even real. I have no reason to have to feel like I need to be rational to hate him for hitting a little girl, and you don't need to come in here and act like you're better than everyone because you want to sympathize with a fucking child abuser.
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