Romances in Final Season a good idea?

13

Comments

  • Romance and Sentimental relantionships are facet of Human relantionships, it makes sense for they would at least focus some attention to it: A group preppers who always on a grim mood while sharpening their knives and cooking weasel stew while thinking about nothing more than where the next edible vermin will come from...Is kinda boring

    Family ties have been plenty explored with Kenny Lee and, arguably, are contintinued to be explored through Clem and AJ. Getting to know other facets of Clem personality is a welcome developtment

    big_rorse posted: »

    i think im referring more to the entertainment aspect of the game rather than the actual nature of their lives like im just saying

  • It is a new avenue of storytelling for Clem. She only got as far as a crush last time. It is growth, evolution.

  • Not that you are wrong, but I'd just like to point out that most often luck finds its way to the people that seek it actively. I think the important part about Clementine is that's what she is, an instigator, an investigator, a provocateur etc.

    You could say "she was lucky to stumble upon Luke and Pete," but you could also say "it's because of her foritude that she wobbled her way as far as she could, into their area."
    As you said, they are all elements of survival, but I don't think you can chalk it down to just luck alone. Not with Clementine at least.

    Ryousan posted: »

    You could also chalk it down to being lucky...or well accompanied - and both apply to Clem - as disfunctional as Luke´s Group was

  • This is TWD, not real life.

    Ok I just have to point out how flawed your thinking is. In real life there are no assurances that you will marry and everyone will live. Life is about taking chances and trying to survive and be as happy as you can.

  • It was Juluis Cesar who said than in any conflict Fortune has a great deal influence, and even the slightest factors can influence the end result in unseen ways.

    You can say that Clementine fortitude both physical and mental allow to venture that far and the Cabin, but the thing is, both of thsoe traits would been irrelevant if tehre was no one there, here her survival was on a roll of a dice: That there were people there and that were people who were willing to help

    There no way in which she could have instigated that. And thats the thing about Survival, some times its only due to daft luck that an outcome is decided

    Nikolaj-11 posted: »

    Not that you are wrong, but I'd just like to point out that most often luck finds its way to the people that seek it actively. I t

  • Romance is a totally different set of things than being a parent. Parenting is a responsibility. The former is not.

    Ryousan posted: »

    She wouldnt be here if not for her parents, remember? Nor would AJ. The thing about affection is tht you have to accept vulner

  • edited October 2018

    I have to disagree with Mary on the part of it being the player's control, atleast narratively... While ultimately the player decides whether Clem rejects or not, both Violet and Louis are obviously infatuated with Clem and it's weirdly pressed onto the player.

    Violet is even weirder since she hints nothing at all in EP1 that she even tolerates Clem but suddenly on the tower she basically confesses her "love" towards Clem and puts her on the proverbial spot. Where did that come from?

    Louis atleast is shown to obviously like Clem from the first episode. But to me it gets unrealistic when the entirety of Episode 2 he wants nothing to do with AJ or Clem. Especially when I played a Savage Clem who continuously him to fuck off. There shouldn't be such an immediate turnaround.

    It just reminds of Liara from Mass Effect. Liara is forever creepily infatuated with Shepard no matter how much you don't interact with her or don't like her. The narrative forces an invisible bond that the player can't control entirely in comparison to other characters. The game basically told you "she is the intended romance, romance her!". In TFS, it's basically "BOTH of them are for you! romance them!"

    I don't know, maybe it's too soon to judge. I want to see what this "friendship" entails in Episode 3 and 4.

    GSSalvador posted: »

    I think this thread from the lead writer of episode 2 about the hows and whys of the romances should be included here. https://www.twitter.com/maryknews/status/1046786746560606213

  • Well, every single deadbeast parent out tehre might beg to differ but the principle is mostly the same: All relantipships are based of measure of mutually shared trust. All human relantionships are based on that premise.

    The difference is that with Romantic relantionships you trust enough someone to expose a side of yourself that others can hurt on an intimate level. And we expect that trust will be reciprocated, this generating an unwritten responsability with other to not hurt that trust

    It work for all human relantionships. Every single one of them

    Romance is a totally different set of things than being a parent. Parenting is a responsibility. The former is not.

  • Liara could be excused on the premise that she was an Alien, obviously courtship and Romance will be different in Asari culture. But even we were toe xclude that element...What was really the harm? Infatuations happen. Love at first sight is a thing. You could her for being sweet on the man who save her from an army of murder-bots

    As for Violet, I agree that she seems to go through the motions a little to far for my taste. But I think it has more to do with the fact that none of them has had any means to learn proper courtship, nor the time to actively engage in it, they are kdis who left on their own for almost half a decade. Anomalous approachs to romance are to be expected...

    Louis is a case a apart, he does go through the motions more organicly...and yet people flak him for it: He had every right to angry about the fact that Marlon was gunned down in cold blood but he had to put it in the context of what Marlon did. And so, as we se,, he couldnt be "Really" angry at AJ and Clem.

    I have to disagree with Mary on the part of it being the player's control, atleast narratively... While ultimately the player deci

  • Of course, I'm saying romance is something you voluntarily choose to endure, though, more than most interactions with human beings. You choose to feel and it's a very momentary on the whim thing. Raising someone is a utilitarian responsibility that often feels mandatory, hence why most parents aren't deadbeats.

    Ryousan posted: »

    Well, every single deadbeast parent out tehre might beg to differ but the principle is mostly the same: All relantipships are base

  • edited October 2018

    The harm is that it causes dissonance in the narrative. It's a game first and foremost. If my Shepard rejects Liara or hardly interacts with her, that should be the end of it in terms of the mechanics of the narrative itself moving forward. But literally throughout all the trilogy there's just a constant feeling of Bioware whispering to you "hey she's the default romance, you know that right?" when it came to Liara.

    The forced infatuation is lame and only makes sense for people who end up romancing these particular characters anyway. Obviously if you romanced Liara you wouldn't care that she's obsessed with Shepard -- you'd actually find it more enjoyable.

    In real life, it's called getting the hint and moving on.

    In-game I give Louis flack for being an asshole because I'd like to put myself in Clem's shoes and imagine how would I emotionally feel about someone constantly badgering and blaming for something? If someone is having visceral beef with you, usually you don't try to accommodate them.

    Ryousan posted: »

    Liara could be excused on the premise that she was an Alien, obviously courtship and Romance will be different in Asari culture. B

  • All Human Relationships are the product of a Choice: The difference between blood ties and romantic ties is that there no social or economic pressure to sustain them. Taking the situation into context, CLem had no responsability to raise AJ in the same vein that Lee had no responsability towards her

    They both choose, free from whatever pressure could be applied, to taken upon themselves that task.

    Of course, I'm saying romance is something you voluntarily choose to endure, though, more than most interactions with human beings

  • james romance when

  • Well, Ithought that the Narrative os Mass Effect was about preventing the Return the Reapers. How Liara´s infatuation creates any dissonance with that? Its easy to ignore if you just dont talk to her. And if you just tlak to her, you will have to deal with it, because again: This is socially awkard ALIEN we are talking about. I think we can spare her not knowing about human courtship

    As for Louis, you could a case about it if not for a crucial detail: AJ did kill Marlon in cold blood. I guess it all boild down on how you play Clem, but I dont that is something that should be easily shrugged off, its human life thats has been lost forever after all. In the case of louis, the life of his best friend.

    I dont one can realistically expect to move on quickly in that scenario.

    The harm is that it causes dissonance in the narrative. It's a game first and foremost. If my Shepard rejects Liara or hardly inte

  • Because Liara is directly involved with the plot, man. Especially in Mass Effect 3.

    Liara is not socially retarded, she's several hundred years old and she's interacted with plenty humans and species by the time the first game ends. It's not an "alien" thing at all. It's her being a writer's pet.

    I'm not disagreeing what losing Marlon was like for Louis. He should be biased. It makes sense. I'm saying that doesn't mean my Clem has to take his or Mitch's shit for it.

    Ryousan posted: »

    Well, Ithought that the Narrative os Mass Effect was about preventing the Return the Reapers. How Liara´s infatuation creates any

  • both Violet and Louis are obviously infatuated with Clem and it's weirdly pressed onto the player.
    Violet is even weirder since she hints nothing at all in EP1 that she even tolerates Clem but suddenly on the tower she basically confesses her "love" towards Clem and puts her on the proverbial spot. Where did that come from?

    Louis atleast is shown to obviously like Clem from the first episode. But to me it gets unrealistic when the entirety of Episode 2 he wants nothing to do with AJ or Clem. Especially when I played a Savage Clem who continuously him to fuck off. There shouldn't be such an immediate turnaround.

    To give half of cent on this, I felt the "romance" in general here was kinda tacked in. Not in the sense that it comes out of nowhere, but it just felt like the scenes themselves was kinda of awkward placed and to an extent, executed in the episode.

    On Louis's end, despite what some people and initially Telltale say about him, I don't explicitly get "flirty" out of him most of the time. Like sure, he's generally trying to make her feel more lively and can seem just a bit smarmy/provocative on occasion, but he's like that with the other characters as well(try not take that out of context, please). And the scene where he's alone with her in the piano room before going on watch for the Deltas is a little more of the usual and if anything, the "romance" stuff is entirely optional and primarily from her end from what I remember. There's something else attached to that that I don't think I've gotten into yet, but it's not important.

    Moving onto Violet, at least on topic, I suppose she does exhibit some degree of affection, but that's partially based in comparison to Louis. A notable trait I've described her with that sorta comes up in Louis, but isn't near as "frequent" or overt is her tendency to be on the sick side, in this case, being...libertine. As the kids say nowadays, she's not all that subtle(or really ashamed) about being thirsty and that Fishing Shack proved more than one thing about her. And in regards to going to the tower thing, I've only tracked it down once, so any details are blank on me, but the general idea seemed to be that she wanted to be alone with her I think. The awkwardness thus forth comes in with the fact that she didn't spend that much time with Clementeen to be so concerned with her or doing much of anything in the episode for that matter.

    I have to disagree with Mary on the part of it being the player's control, atleast narratively... While ultimately the player deci

  • Louis is a class clown with the others too but the boyfriend question from the first card game wasn't flirty to you? And the second card game he flirts again, pushing Clem to answer about who she likes.

    DabigRG posted: »

    both Violet and Louis are obviously infatuated with Clem and it's weirdly pressed onto the player. Violet is even weirder since

  • well all im saying is this game has come up with plennnnty of interesting plots without touching on romance

    Ryousan posted: »

    Romance and Sentimental relantionships are facet of Human relantionships, it makes sense for they would at least focus some atten

  • guys...ITS A FUCKING GAME chill out

  • have to disagree with Mary on the part of it being the player's control, atleast narratively... While ultimately the player decides whether Clem rejects or not, both Violet and Louis are obviously infatuated with Clem and it's weirdly pressed onto the player.

    Violet is even weirder since she hints nothing at all in EP1 that she even tolerates Clem but suddenly on the tower she basically confesses her "love" towards Clem and puts her on the proverbial spot. Where did that come from?

    I disagree. The great thing about this scene is, that it's actually pretty vague what they feel until you do the first step. Violet tells Clem how she can't imagine if Clem was gone, which you can interpret in both a romantic or a best friend kind of way.

    You choose what it is. If you choose to engage in a romantic relationship, so will Violet. If you want them to be best friends, so will Violet.

    I have to disagree with Mary on the part of it being the player's control, atleast narratively... While ultimately the player deci

  • edited October 2018

    Hmm...

    I chose the silent option though. I left Violet hanging.

    Interestingly enough, Mary Kenney says that if you choose the silent option your status with them is actually casual friendship.

    So apparently there's even a third option they wrote in, and my choice of silence would trigger the status into a casual sense of friendship rather than the super duper best friends status that the friendship dialogue option implies (Mary calls it "BFF") or the romance.

    They like you, you're friends, but more casually. Not BFFs or romances.

    — Mary Kenney (@maryknews) October 1, 2018

    Again, looking to see how this plays out further. Mary says they're all valid options and they all have their own separate depths and it's not a one-sided thing.

    GSSalvador posted: »

    have to disagree with Mary on the part of it being the player's control, atleast narratively... While ultimately the player decide

  • all ships suck and live for the fuckheads in this forum

  • edited October 2018

    This forum isn't bad there's actual varied, insightful discussions on here, and the ships are self-contained in one big thread.

    The subreddit on reddit is far worse. Sometimes it feels like half of it only exists for the shipping wars and the unhealthy Kenny cult.

    Sir_Tubs posted: »

    all ships suck and live for the fuckheads in this forum

  • I keep trying to politely state my opinion that i and many others find shipping and romance gay as fuck but people keep elaborately explaining every philosophical reason why im wrong

    Sir_Tubs posted: »

    all ships suck and live for the fuckheads in this forum

  • Opinions. I agree with you but it doesnt make you smarter or better than the other people who like this kind of stuff.

    Sir_Tubs posted: »

    all ships suck and live for the fuckheads in this forum

  • so youre basically saying that clem isnt smart ok then
    resourceful and quick to adapt is what normal people call smart

    Ryousan posted: »

    You could also chalk it down to being lucky...or well accompanied - and both apply to Clem - as disfunctional as Luke´s Group was

  • "Gay as fuck"

    Dude. That's not necessary.

    big_rorse posted: »

    I keep trying to politely state my opinion that i and many others find shipping and romance gay as fuck but people keep elaborately explaining every philosophical reason why im wrong

  • edited October 2018

    Bro ive literally been making several comments actively trying to avoid using that expression and using words like cheesy instead but people dont seem to get what im trying to say and saying my opinion is wrong so i cbf

    GSSalvador posted: »

    "Gay as fuck" Dude. That's not necessary.

  • buddy, these guys are toxic, nobody can tell them anything

    big_rorse posted: »

    I keep trying to politely state my opinion that i and many others find shipping and romance gay as fuck but people keep elaborately explaining every philosophical reason why im wrong

  • ...So, you would call a cokroach smart?

    big_rorse posted: »

    so youre basically saying that clem isnt smart ok then resourceful and quick to adapt is what normal people call smart

  • I said most of the time.
    And even in that first case, he actually betrayed a little hesitance about asking it and Violet is not only the one who pushed him into doing so, but was much more vocallly interested in the answer.

    Louis is a class clown with the others too but the boyfriend question from the first card game wasn't flirty to you? And the second card game he flirts again, pushing Clem to answer about who she likes.

  • All ships live for the fuckheads in this forum?

    Sir_Tubs posted: »

    all ships suck and live for the fuckheads in this forum

  • THIS.

    I have to disagree with Mary on the part of it being the player's control, atleast narratively... While ultimately the player deci

  • Honestly, it would appear that the Romance is literally the only thing people are interested in with this Season[ again].

  • How? There a lot of threads about different stuff than romance.

    DabigRG posted: »

    Honestly, it would appear that the Romance is literally the only thing people are interested in with this Season[ again].

  • And the question is, whats wrong with it trying something new?

    big_rorse posted: »

    well all im saying is this game has come up with plennnnty of interesting plots without touching on romance

  • How did I miss this comment?

    @NexusFire How? There a lot of threads about different stuff than romance.

    How long have they generally lasted and how thought out are some of the comments, though?
    What kind of character/story arcs and developments are people expecting?
    How fleshed out are most of the characters thus far?
    Is Telltale's future guaranteed to continue being so thriving?
    Do we really give much of a shit anymore?

    big_rorse posted: »

    well all im saying is this game has come up with plennnnty of interesting plots without touching on romance

  • -Some have are pretty long lived
    -Lilly´s nature and ultimate fate, The outcome of the War with Delta. Who will die next. Who will AJ will end up to be, to name a few...
    -Enough. More than Alvin or Bree for that matter,
    -It thing the current situation should answer that...
    -At least on my end yes, I genuily like whats been done here, including the romance: Im tired of angry survivalist plots, I like the chaarcters show some humanity for a change

    DabigRG posted: »

    How did I miss this comment? @NexusFire How? There a lot of threads about different stuff than romance. How long hav

  • Why are you stating your opinion if you are unwilling to have it challenged? It can't surprise you that when you say something that some don't agree with, they're gonna comment back.

    big_rorse posted: »

    I keep trying to politely state my opinion that i and many others find shipping and romance gay as fuck but people keep elaborately explaining every philosophical reason why im wrong

  • What @Ryousan said.

    DabigRG posted: »

    How did I miss this comment? @NexusFire How? There a lot of threads about different stuff than romance. How long hav

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