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Kingdom of Sorrow

posted by exo on - last edited - Viewed by 2K users
Infamous Adventures (guys who remade KQ3 originally), recently released their SQ2 remake and anounced a King's Quest game based somewhat on the Kingdom of Sorrow novel.

Think I may be more excited about that game then this one. Likely won't have the production value of Tell Tale, but it looks like it may 'feel' a lot more like a traditional sierra game.

Too bad the guys at AGD Interactive aren't doing it though - they seem to have the best grasp of the aspects of KQ games that I enjoy.
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  • BTW, so I did a bit of research on "Kenyon Morr" pseudonym author of "Kingdom of Sorrow";

    I discovered this;

    Mark Sumner one of the co-authors is a fantasy, sciene fiction and children's author of several books... He's probably more currently known more for his contributions to the liberal Daily Kos website.

    From his own website;
    Who is this guy?
    Just another one of those astounding folks who worked for years, wrote thousands of pages, and managed to become an overnight example of mediocrity.

    Apparently one of his series "News from the Edge" became a TV series on the Sci-Fi Channel.

    "Marella Sands'' is a pseudonym for;

    She apparently is fairly prolific non-fiction, science fiction, and fantasy author... But I think she is pretty obscure... Most of her books are published under 'Marella Sands' pseudonym...

    This is her website, and she's apparently on 'facebook'.

    Both appear to be part of a writing group calling themselves the "Alternate Historians".

    Now I wonder if I should try to contact them and interview them! LOL.

    BTW, the third author Craig Mills who wrote The Floating Castle, only wrote a few books, and was found dead while in the middle of research on another. There was a poignant announcement on a website in memorial, discussing his fits of depression, that he was somewhat of a loner, and last year of his life. However the website and the message are now gone (except in wayback machine).

    His story is sort of a sad one, considering KQ was his chance of getting back into the writing industry (he had only written three previous books), but he didn't work too well with 'packagers'...
  • Anakin Skywalker;573421 said:
    Since it is now canon (from TSL) that Graham and his family are deeply tortured people, I think they need to work out their emotions.
    It is not canon. TSL is not canon, and by that I mean that it is bad fan-fiction.

    AGDI's games, however, are good. Some people might want to call them canon, other people want to call them fan-fiction. What matters is that, whether it is fan-fiction or not, it is good while TSL is not.

    The most change that AGDI might have made is in the history, a few minor relationships, and the original motivation behind specific acts. All the while, the color, tone and feel that one expects from a KQ game are still there.

    TSL, on the other hand, has a completely different tone to the characters, color to the setting, and feel to the story than KQ was ever known for. It just doesn't fit. Also, AGDI adding relationship between Lolotte and Mannannan can be either interesting or shrug worthy, while TSL making Mannannan related to Valanice is eye-rollingly stupid.

    Interesting discussion concerning KQ2 AGD on the Infamous Adventures board... It's interesting to see that some of the IA team members, have the same reservations about AGD's games as I had... So its not like I'm entirely alone with these feelings... For example Gargin...

    Other fans, also felt the idea of a 'good' vampire and especially girl being turned into a vampire without any emotional repercussions was too dark for King's Quest... or that the Father storyline bordered on bad fan fiction...

    As in there are things that some fans view as 'not fitting into KQ' from their viewpoint.

    It makes it much easier to understand the IA's approach when it comes to their games, as far as trying to keep things 1:1, and not deviating too much from the originals...

    I'm seriously not the only one who sees it this way... But to each their own...
    Also, AGDI adding relationship between Lolotte and Mannannan can be either interesting or shrug worthy, while TSL making Mannannan related to Valanice is eye-rollingly stupid.
    Well, KQ3 Redux did make Lolotte and Malicia sisters, but according to the ending of KQ7 that's not the case! Lolotte is not Titania's sister, and not Edgar's aunt, as mentioned in the ending.

    Other than that, I think KQ3 Redux actually moved much closer to the spirit of KQ than their previous game. There are things I like about it more than the IA version. But there are things where IA did things better (I can't wait to play their Gold Edition).

    Don't get me wrong, I found all the fan games fun to play (even though I have reservations and criticism over some aspects)... I just prefer to play the originals in general...
  • We've also remade 1:1 games at AGD Interactive. Namely our King's Quest 1 and Quest for Glory 2 remakes. These are, more or less, on the same wavelength as IA's Space Quest 2 remake, as far as canon is concerned.

    The vampirization of Possum/Anastasia, the little girl, was actually one of the things I suggested changing before the KQ2 remake went public, but the writer wanted it left that way. And because it was his story and his vision, it was kept as-is. Actually, there was more planned for the Anastasia storyline in future installments of Daniel's story and the state of her condition would have been confronted again and perhaps closure provided on what happened to her.

    All that aside, if KQ2 had been remade by us for commercial consumption, it would have adhered to the 1:1 story structure like our KQ1 and QFG2 remakes do.
  • Bonito I agree, I think the QFG2 and KQ1 remakes are very much in line with original games, almost carbon copies! Both of those are probably more true 1:1 than even IA's games...

    There are little or no deviations from the scripts, there is a nearly straight reliance on originals artwork, and few new additions (except for QFG2 of course with its bonus secret bosses and areas).

    It's not nearly the change as there was between KQ1AGI and KQ1SCI for example (I personally don't consider those two to be 1:1, but more like 1:1.5). There are very few changes between KQ1SCI and KQ1VGA (even if one takes the Enhanced version into consideration). Not even any puzzle changes.

    Still I think it would be fun to play a KQ1+ Redux, whatever you call it, just to see what kind of new puzzles people could come up with!
  • In KQ2+, Possum becoming Anastasia IS unsettling...but the game itself acknowledges that. Graham gives the impression of thinking what's happened to her is kind of messed up when you talk to or look at her and he realizes this is Possum. It's not like the game or Graham ignore that.
  • I think its not the problem that the game might 'acknowledge' it in a way, just that some of us think that the concept itself is too dark for what appeared in King's Quest in general. It's not the kind of thing Roberta did in her games, except for maybe if you take Phantasmagoria into consideration (and she received criticism for that game for that very reason, interestingly enough)...

    The same can be said for some elements in TSL, you have added quite a few dark things, even some ideas such as parental abuse and perhaps going as far as 'mind raping' (Manannan to Valanice, or Shadrack to Rosella). Yes, your game does a decent job of 'acknowledging' how disturbing such concepts are... But do such concepts fit into what KQ is known for, or have appeared in previous KQ games? Many fans don't believe so... others might... I guess to each their own...

    But I fall under the crowd that thinks some of this subject matter is too dark for KQ, and better fits into the realms of Gabriel Knight or other psychological thrillers.

    Even official companies can do things to a series that don't always pass judgement by all the fans.

    Lucasfilm received some criticism for a scene that appeared in the Radio Show version of Stars Wars films, in which Vader tortures Leia... Some critics likened it to rape, incest or molestation, because the way Vader was showing enjoyment over it, and acting as if he is her 'father' Bail Organa (while Leia screamed and moaned throughout the entire scene), and in hindsight they knew she was really his daughter... They felt that while Star Wars has scenes of dramatic darkness, that overall the original trilogy never got as dark or disturbing as that scene, since it was designed for children to watch! They felt that such a scene in the radio show, far more 'porno'graphic in nature, was disturbingly not for children or the squeemish!
  • Hahaha...mind-raping. That's what TSL is, definitely. A mind-rape. ;)

    Joking aside, and on another note, I don't consider our SQ2 remake to be 1:1 at all. I'd definitely consider it more of a remix. Lots of areas are fairly 1:1, but new puzzles, re-imagined scenes, additional cutscene content, all place it firmly into the realm of a redux or some such thing. We were going for the amount of re-imagining that went into Sierra's SQ1 remake, with a few additional extras.
  • Lambonius, SQ2 Deluxe is great, I feel its more like a 1:1.5 or 1:1.75 mix, 1:2 at the most... It feels alot like how SQ1VGA remixed SQ1EGA (but not as much as PQ1VGA did to PQ1EGA (enough that the final score and most puzzles are different in each game!)). It feels overall to fit within what SQ was in general! It makes alot of great nods to (and pokes fun of) itself, the original SQ2, and the series in general.

    It goes slightly more than KQ1SCI did to KQ1VGA (which itself made quite a few changes), but is still in that ballpark IMO! But then again, I haven't seen the ending yet, its possible that it is even further beyond the original!

    Maybe the best way for me to describe it is, its the kind of remake I came to expect from Sierra's own remakes... It's that close!

    Not to mention one of your new 'cutscenes' is actually just directly pulled out or inspired by the old "Space Piston Magazine' 'comix' from SQ2. That was a great nod to the old game and its documentation! Or you took an old joke, but made it visual (the larry dream sequence)! So its not as if you 'completely invented' them!

    Likewise some of the additions to the new cutscenes included in KQ1SCI were inspired by elements of the game's documentation!
  • There are two reasons why I like KQ3Redux over IA's KQ3. In IA's game, the voice acting is subpar for certain characters such as the barmaid and Guybrush, and the player has to click after each and every line of dialogue.

    If not for those two things I would like them both equally, just for separate reasons.
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