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posted by kaptein_kaffe on - last edited - Viewed by 5.1K users
Discussing religion is generally a very bad idea on the internet, but there are a lot of down to earth and rational people on this forum so I decided to give it a go.

I want to hear your beliefs. Also, try to keep an open mind and show respect to other people's opinions. I don't care weather you're a fanatic catholic, fanatic atheist or whatever. Arguing about "who's right" is just a terrible cliche.

Personally I believe that there is a god. I'm not agnostic, I believe in god, but that's just my own spiritual reflection on it. I don't judge other religions and say that "this is right", it's more along the lines of Baruch de Spinoza's take on it where you see god as everything. Maybe there's a word for what that is, I don't know. I prefer to look at everything that is beyond our understanding with humility. Most of my religious knowledge lies within catholicism and I generally agree with the ten commandments, but I also believe that the religion is blurred for the sake of politics, ways of maintaining order and fanatic influences (edit: + things that are lost in translation). In short, I'm a read between the lines kind of guy.

My knowledge on the subject is limited, so it's possible that I won't be able to keep up with the discussion. I'd just like to hear your views :)
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  • Farlander;594915 said:
    Don't you think that one could say the same of Christianity, it being based on pointless traditions, rituals and monuments[?]
    No, not really. At its core, Christianity is more focused on relationship than ritualistic tradition; that's what all else revolves around in the faith. Sure, modern Christianity has had a lot of crap added to it, and, in many denominations, it has also become another religion which is surrounded by traditions, rituals and monuments, to the point where these are actually prioritized. But all of this is the doing of man - misguided people who have decided to add their own little tidbits onto Christianity, further tainting it, and clouding what it's actually all about when in its pure form: relationship with the creator.

    In my view, that's all that is important. Everything is secondary, and all else will fall into place so long as a relationship with the creator is established. So, in my opinion, I view rituals, traditions and physical monuments and mostly superficial. And if these things are prioritized over a creation-to-creator relationship/connection, then we have a religion that I believe to be surrounded in superficiality.
    Farlander;594915 said:
    Where's the humility and kindness in calling most other religions superficial?
    It's an opinion; it's a viewpoint. I exercise humility and kindness towards people through my actions, and I wouldn't do any differently to anybody from a different religion, nor would I ever insult another religious person for their faith. Still, this doesn't stop me from viewing other religions as somewhat superficial, does it?

    Edit: BUT! With all that being said, yes, there was probably an element of arrogance in my initial post, and an element of arrogance in this one too. Perhaps I shouldn't be quite as critical of other religions and their practices, as perhaps that can be a little offensive, insensitive and slightly hypocritical.
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    puzzlebox Telltale Staff
    DAISHI;594911 said:
    You allude to my point, yes. I can only exist in one of two realities. One, that nothing is right or wrong, and that all things are subjective. Under this system, morality is utilitarian, used only to settle on what general framework allows a society to exist without cannibalizing itself. Under this system, because all things are subjective, there is no right. It's all alterable or subjective.

    I'm not inherently opposed to such a system per se, but I've found that an objective morality is at least more appealing in that it establishes a framework in which there can be a definite right and wrong. Now, I can also be tolerant of other people's differences and live side by side with them under this objective system. I can think a person is existing wrongly without imposing my morality on them (thus I have no problem with the notion of legalized drug use, for instance, which I don't believe the government should regulate), and still coexist and maintain my personal beliefs.
    Are you implying that this is an argument for following an organised religion? If so, it's a false dichotomy. There are plenty of normative ethical theories that aren't coupled with a specific religion and go beyond utilitarianism. You can have an objective moral framework (i.e. believe that some things are inviolably right or wrong, as in natural rights theories) without believing in a deity.
  • i am agnostic, so i believe there is a possibility of a god, but there are also many other possibilities so worshiping one specific god and not the others doesn't make sense to me.

    what is it about the specific religions that people believe in that made them choose that religion over another?
  • If I had to guess, it's the way of life it provides. And not all religions necessarily have to have a specific god associated with them.
  • Alcoremortis;753814 said:
    If I had to guess, it's the way of life it provides. And not all religions necessarily have to have a specific god associated with them.
    yeah that was included in my "there are also many other possibilities" that includes everything from "we are the sims" to "only i exist" and all religions inbetween
  • I think I may have not completely have woken up when I read that. But yeah, I always thought it was ridiculous to change religions, even when I was a kid. Back then, my reasoning was: If you can't believe in the god you grew up with, what makes you think that switching to a different one will make any difference?

    I guess it was because deep inside, I knew back then that every religion was more or less teaching the same thing at it's core, just with different flavorings sprinkled on top. I guess the flavor could make all the difference in the world, but choosing one over the other is like saying that you like green ham over the regular color when there's no real underlying difference in taste.

    Reading back over this, I'm not entirely sure I'm making sense, so if I'm not, I'm probably still half asleep and apparently hungry.
  • what if nobody believes in the correct god and everybody goes to hell (or equivalent) because gods are just like that from what i have heard about them
  • thestalkinghead;753904 said:
    what if nobody believes in the correct god and everybody goes to hell (or equivalent) because gods are just like that from what i have heard about them
    Then hell will be just like regular life, but with more fire and demons. So yeah, just like regular life.
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